DiscussionTo what degree do "trans camps for kids" function similarly to gay conversion camps?

submitted by reluctant_commenter from (self.LGBDropTheT)

I have no experience with "LGBTQ+" or transgender summer camps for children myself, and have only heard vaguely about them. Bit of context:

^ You'll notice if you keyword search in that article "trans" it's a lot more common than "gay" or "lesbian" or "bisexual," of course.

The NYT article describes how campers (elementary school aged to late teens) at one camp, for example, are encouraged to "take a Trans 101 workshop, a transgender history course and a transgender rights class." It sounds like some level of indoctrination at these camps is to be expected (as one would expect), but I'm curious as to how these summer camps might compare to religious conversion camps.

Anyone read up more on this subject, have any experiences to share, or have general thoughts about these camps?

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[–]Dromedary 17 insightful - 5 fun17 insightful - 4 fun18 insightful - 5 fun -  (3 children)

Oh sweet Lordy me, I can't imagine what sort of fantastical fairy tales they'll be indoctrinating the kids with "in a transgender history course". Trans signers of the Declaration of Independence. All-trans battalions storming the beaches at Normandy. Marsha P Johnson inventing the Internet. I mean, they've shown there's no limit for lying and disinformation in their ideology, it's encouraged.

[–]SnowAssMan 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

ikr, there is no transgender history. But history of a group is very important in the US, I've noticed. It's interesting to see when they tell the truth & when they revise history completely. Like how Italian Americans proliferated the lie that an Italian discovered America, in order to solidify their legitimacy as American citizens. Or like how white Americans think they were all "pilgrims" escaping "religious persecution", instead of as puritans who had been exiled to the colonies. The make sure to emphasise slavery as being African Americans' only heritage though. It influences everyone's view of a group & the group's view of itself.

If people knew that there is no trans history (just gay history that has been appropriated by trans hysteria) then they'd be more sceptical. Scepticism is deadly to transgender ideology.

[–]reluctant_commenter[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Like how Italian Americans proliferated the lie that an Italian discovered America, in order to solidify their legitimacy as American citizens.

Oh, is that how that one got started? Huh. Makes sense, I guess.

[–]usehername 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Trans men" living their lives dressed as men, having wives, while the "cis women" and "cis lesbians" stayed home and served their husbands like good little women.

[–]worried19 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I remember watching this documentary about a transgender summer camp:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N90m5B2jm80

You can tell it was released back in 2015 because all the talking points hadn't solidified yet. One thing I found most disturbing about the camp is that it collected dozens of GNC little boys together, but the camp did not provide even one GNC adult male role model. There was nothing to indicate that any of these children ever saw an example of an adult man like them.

When children don't see adult models of themselves, they can't picture themselves as adults. It happened to me as a kid. I couldn't picture myself growing up to be a woman like the women around me. Luckily the mid to late 2000s was before children were encouraged to be transgender. So nothing permanent ever resulted from my disidentification with others of the female sex.

This might be an interesting topic for the debate sub, too, if you'd like to crosspost it there.

[–]MarkJeffersonTight defenses and we draw the line 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The number of Trans groomers in the comments of that video pisses me off.

[–]reluctant_commenter[S] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Thanks for sharing! I will take a look.

One thing I found most disturbing about the camp is that it collected dozens of GNC little boys together, but the camp did not provide even one GNC adult male role model. There was nothing to indicate that any of these children ever saw an example of an adult man like them.

When children don't see adult models of themselves, they can't picture themselves as adults. It happened to me as a kid. I couldn't picture myself growing up to be a woman like the women around me.

Completely agree. I felt that way too growing up, and I'm sorry that you did. It often seems to me as if there is a massive proliferation of stereotypes about LGB adults, and almost nothing in the way of LGB adult role models; I sure had that experience when I was a kid, anyway.

That does sound like a potentially interesting debate topic, and I've sometimes wandered over to s/GCdebatesQT, but I probably won't post this one; if you want to, please feel free!

[–]PatsyStoneMaverique 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Completely agree. I felt that way too growing up, and I'm sorry that you did. It often seems to me as if there is a massive proliferation of stereotypes about LGB adults, and almost nothing in the way of LGB adult role models; I sure had that experience when I was a kid, anyway.

I was just thinking about this earlier today in relation to RuPaul's Drag Race, of all things. I was at a rural liberal arts college when the first season came out and me and my little clique of closeted lesbians and bis were passionate fans from the first episode.

It was the first time I'd seen gay adults in a group (men, yes, but still,) and the first thing I latched onto was the behaviors they were modeling to cope with anger. Talking about issues on the show also gave my little group of friends common ground to talk about them in our own lives. Kind of like learning a language. It was revolutionary in its first couple of seasons.

I wonder what a female equivalent to that could be.

[–]reluctant_commenter[S] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That does sound like a revelationary experience. I tend to avoid most "LGBTQ+" shows, myself, just because they seem so unrelatable... but I'd imagine there's been a massive tone shift since Ru Paul's show originally came out.

[–]SuperGayIsOkay 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Aside from the indoctrination aspect, the main issue with these trans promoting places is they essentially don't do any pushback whatsoever. They're never willing to ask "could it be your dysphoria is the result of an underlying mental health issue?" and instead push transing children as the first step in mental health wellness, rather than being willing to do the difficult task of uncovering and treating the underlying issues.

Transgenderism is essentially slapping band-aid solutions on complex issues of gender dysphoria and autogynephilia, and pretending that letting mental illness go untreated is supposed to be empowering.

[–]reluctant_commenter[S] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That's a really good way to summarize it.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

[–]MarkJeffersonTight defenses and we draw the line 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

First link paywalled so archive.

[–]reluctant_commenter[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you!